A place to let loose your LoL champcrafting creativity!


    What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Share
    avatar
    ElementSteel

    Posts : 157
    Join date : 2013-02-11
    Age : 25
    Location : Lil' Rhodie

    What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by ElementSteel on Wed Feb 20, 2013 5:36 am

    Sometimes, I look back at my concepts and feel like they're just gimmicky... I have two that each have an ammo system, be for skills or otherwise. Then there's another that focuses completely on pet minions. Then there's another one that can act like an item! But that's the thing. It feels like that's what sets them apart from other concepts, be they official or unofficial. It feels like I might be doing something wrong because I rely on these tricks. But do these gimmicks work enough to help make the concept as a whole unique?
    avatar
    ploki122

    Posts : 48
    Join date : 2013-02-16
    Age : 25
    Location : Quebec, Canada

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by ploki122 on Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:17 am

    Honestly, I don't think a kit will make a champion unique... it's the artists that gives life to your champion and make him unique...

    Honeslty, if you look at Vi, she's very unique... and then you realize that all she has is an added AoE on a punch...

    I think that if you are a designer, your job is to make your product appealing, if you're an artist, your job is to make it unique... It may feel a bit counter-intuitive, but that's still my view of it.
    avatar
    MynxTheOrigin

    Posts : 275
    Join date : 2013-02-12
    Age : 22
    Location : Maine

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by MynxTheOrigin on Tue Feb 26, 2013 4:13 pm

    Regardless of your designs being unique or not, I almost always find them very interesting.
    avatar
    MynxTheOrigin

    Posts : 275
    Join date : 2013-02-12
    Age : 22
    Location : Maine

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by MynxTheOrigin on Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:57 pm

    MynxTheOrigin wrote:Regardless of your designs being unique or not, I almost always find them very interesting.

    Like, "Why aren't you in the game!?" interesting.
    avatar
    ElementSteel

    Posts : 157
    Join date : 2013-02-11
    Age : 25
    Location : Lil' Rhodie

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by ElementSteel on Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:59 pm

    MynxTheOrigin wrote:
    MynxTheOrigin wrote:Regardless of your designs being unique or not, I almost always find them very interesting.

    Like, "Why aren't you in the game!?" interesting.
    You flatter me. Just sometimes I wonder if mine are in fact cut out for legit play. I mean, you've seen Zoriah! x_x;;
    avatar
    MynxTheOrigin

    Posts : 275
    Join date : 2013-02-12
    Age : 22
    Location : Maine

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by MynxTheOrigin on Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:02 pm

    ElementSteel wrote:
    MynxTheOrigin wrote:
    MynxTheOrigin wrote:Regardless of your designs being unique or not, I almost always find them very interesting.

    Like, "Why aren't you in the game!?" interesting.
    You flatter me. Just sometimes I wonder if mine are in fact cut out for legit play. I mean, you've seen Zoriah! x_x;;

    The only problems I really see with him are his early game power and build options. Smile
    He's one of the ones I REALLY want to play.
    avatar
    Icraig33
    Admin

    Posts : 63
    Join date : 2013-02-10
    Age : 22
    Location : Canada

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by Icraig33 on Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:23 pm

    I agree with Ploki in that it's usually not the kits alone that make champions stand out. It's usually the silhouette/personality that they have that make them interesting. Often they are complimented by a mechanic that sets them apart from the others, but these mechanics alone cannot carry uniqueness for the most part. I like to think of characters like Quinn/valor, Draven and Diana are notable examples.

    Another thing I personally find makes a unique champion is game feel. It's a little more difficult to explain, but when a champion strives for a certain feel and nails it, then it makes for an epic champion. Darius, as bland as his character is and as annoying as he is to fight against, I must admit has amazing game feel. Another personal example is Pantheon (My personal favourite champ). There's just a certain kind of game feel and satisfaction I find in mandropping onto someone and insta-gibbing them in a single combo that I simply can't find on any other champ currently
    avatar
    MynxTheOrigin

    Posts : 275
    Join date : 2013-02-12
    Age : 22
    Location : Maine

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by MynxTheOrigin on Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:45 pm

    Icraig33 wrote:I agree with Ploki in that it's usually not the kits alone that make champions stand out. It's usually the silhouette/personality that they have that make them interesting. Often they are complimented by a mechanic that sets them apart from the others, but these mechanics alone cannot carry uniqueness for the most part. I like to think of characters like Quinn/valor, Draven and Diana are notable examples.

    Another thing I personally find makes a unique champion is game feel. It's a little more difficult to explain, but when a champion strives for a certain feel and nails it, then it makes for an epic champion. Darius, as bland as his character is and as annoying as he is to fight against, I must admit has amazing game feel. Another personal example is Pantheon (My personal favourite champ). There's just a certain kind of game feel and satisfaction I find in mandropping onto someone and insta-gibbing them in a single combo that I simply can't find on any other champ currently

    Yeah, when I want to play a fan champ, it means I liked their lore, playstyle, and even how I imagine it feeling to use them well.

    I understand game feel. I get that when I just pop out of nowhere with Yi's Ult and E active, using Ghost and watching as Yi literally kills the entire team, failing to let any survivors escape. The freak outs and panic never get old. XD
    avatar
    Zarkof

    Posts : 64
    Join date : 2013-02-15
    Age : 27
    Location : New Hampshire

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by Zarkof on Tue Feb 26, 2013 9:35 pm

    Unique is a very complicated idea. It can be many things, but the main concept behind something being unique is the fact that it is different and new. You want to make something that has never been made before under certain circumstances. The problem is that you are limited in what you can make. The other problem is that nothing, by itself, is new. It has already had to exist in order for you to perceive it and reuse it. The key to creating a new, unique concept is taking those old things and putting them together in a new way.

    What you need to do is understand that every concept has basic underlying qualities that interact with each other at every point in the design. You're going to have that Theme that directs what kind of flavor the abilities will have. You're going to have your role, which limits or focuses what kind of abilities you're going to have. And then you have those abilities which influence playstyle. There's always a back-and-forth between everything. All aspects of your concept are going to be related somehow. Each aspect of your concept, as well as the interactions they have, are all places where you can insert your own uniqueness to the overall concept.


    As far as a unique design goes, that has to be based on the problem you are trying to solve (what role this champion is supposed to provide) and how you go about solving that problem (the kind of spells you give them to accomplish their role). Look at Draven, an ADC. He has all the things an ADC should have: Steroid, AA modifier, Mobility affecting skill, and a high-damage skill. How does he accomplish it? You get rewarded for using the axes (procs his passive) AND you get rewarded for being able to handle the new mechanic brought by his axes (catching them). His axes are what make him unique as a champion.

    Look at Darius now. He's a fighter/bruiser. His entire skillset is focused around his passive bleeds. Autos apply it, Q applies it, W applies it but ALSO has reduced cd the more bleeds they have on them, and his ultimate does more damage based on the bleeds. This is a unique way to go about playing a champion. Heck, he doesn't even have any defensive steroids (other than a high base armor, high regen, and good hp/level) but the fact that you can get so much more damage out of his skillset based on proper play allows you to build tanky without sacrificing too much damage. His passive creates a unique playstyle.

    Orianna has the most unique and well designed skillset IMO. Her entire skillset revolves around something no other champion has (until maybe Zed was released): her ball and doing things with it. She can make it go anywhere, dealing damage on the way in an infinite number of possible vectors, apply a slow/speed field anywhere she can place her ball, even if she's out of range of the normal cast zone, shield people and provide them with a buff as long as the ball is still with them, and then her ultimate is a unique take on a displacement ability. She even still has room for her own passive, which also gives her more build opportunities. So, basically, she has damage, cc, and support, but the way she goes about doing that is completely different than any other champion.

    Sona is a good example of how simple can work very well. She has 3 abilities that each do straightforward things: damage, protect, support. Her ultimate also effectively accomplishes all of these. What's unique about it is that she has the Auras that provide the passive boosts to her team based on that spell she just cast, and her passive allows her to boost an additional aspect of her kit (damage, protect, support). It's a simple concept, but still very unique.

    If you want to utilize something that is already in game, do it in a new way. A lot of the basic abilities having to do with crowd control have already been taken, like "this ability damages and snares a target" is already Ryze's Rune Prison. Your abilities should always be doing more than one thing. If you look at Ryze, his Q seems to only do damage. In reality, it synergizes with his passive by reducing the cooldowns of other spells. In addition, it also scales with mana. If you look at Ezreal's Mystic shot, all it seems to be is a skillshot nuke. In reality, it can reduce his other spells' cooldowns if it hits, and also provides him with a stack of his passive if it does. It also applies on-hit effects. If you look at Urgot's Acid Hunter, it seems to just be a skillshot nuke. In reality, it synergizes with his Noxxian Corrosive Charge and his passive. This provides you with a whole new slew of openings for abilities that do things that have already been done. Try and put new things together in a special way. Utilize synergy and secondary effects.


    In terms of taking a theme, or demographic and making it unique, look at Ashe, the Frost Archer. Sure, she's part of that archer demographic: she has the bow, she shoots the arrows, she has that sort of archer flavor to her quotes. But she's not just an archer. She is a FROST archer. Her theme is Freljord, a land of snow and ice. Her abilities reflect that. She still shoots arrows, but she shoots Frost arrows. She plays much like a bow user, but that frosty flair makes her unique.

    If you want an example of how to take a demographic and make it unique, look at Holix, the Arcane Shield. In my opinion, he serves as a good example of a shield-based concept that deviates from the normal shield cliches and puts enough of a thematic spin on it that it becomes unique in its own right.

    I feel like an ass for doing this but I might as well. What I feel makes Holix a unique concept is how differently I went about making a shield champion. You want a shield character that's different from traditional shield characters? Why not have the shield be technological or magic, and the abilities utilize that power instead of the raw force of the champion?

    Usually, people would focus on the physicality of shields and sheer force of will on the champion's part. What I did was focus more on the unique power of the actual shield to work in those basic "Captain America" strength and valor traits. Yes, Holix was military. Yes, he was a good fighter. No, he wasn't able to use his head for school, but he does have that combat intuition. He's not a genius in the lab but he's considered a genius in combat, much like a martial artist. His character isn't particularly inspiring or valorous; rather, he's a skilled fighter. This sets him apart from the "Captain America" demographic on a characteristic level, but his abilities can still lend themselves to it.

    Utilizing the arcane power capabilities of the shield he uses, he can bring that sense of inspiration and valor to the battle without actually being inspiring or valorous in a traditional sense. His passive draws parallels with valor, granting him more strength the more he and his team is losing. The shield charges power when he or his allies take damage based on the residual energies of the attacks (since everything is magic based anyways) and then Holix can turn it back on his enemies, making his abilities more powerful. Instead of physically bashing people with his shield as a form of control or offense, he focuses the energy contained in his shield to send out a burst that cripples his enemies. Instead of having that sort of physical resolve, he draws power from his shield to make himself more durable the more it's charged. Instead of being an inspiration on the battlefield, or shouting to inspire his allies, he uses his shield's energy to empower himself and his allies. Instead of holding his shield up to block attacks or protect his allies, he can use the energy to form a sort of damaging forcefield that shields his allies and damages his enemies. And finally, instead of using pure strength to charge through his enemies with his shield, he uses the charge from his shield to blast skyward and crash down on his enemies with a burst of power.

    He's all very much like a valorous shield-bearer, but his theme differs from the traditional theme. He still accomplishes those traditional ideas but he does it in a very different manner. Granted, I didn't do a very good job with making him an interesting character beyond "From a world of ridicule, he sets out to prove he has what it takes." but that's beside the point.


    What can YOU do to make YOUR concept unique? Use your imagination. Don't just throw out something that already exists and not change it at all. Take the ideas that are already present. Play with them. See how things work. Put them together in ways that haven't been thought of before. If you're going to make an archer, make it interesting. Don't focus the abilities around shooting arrows; Focus the abilities around the unique theme that you give to your character. If you're going to make an elementalist that utilizes the classic elements, do something different with them instead of just having "earth fire water air" abilities. If you're going to utilize existing mechanics (like cc, buffs, damage), try and do it differently than what already exists. And lastly, give your character something that makes it memorable. Gangplank is a pirate in everything he does, but he ate some oranges and it was 'k.


    Making a unique concept is just like solving a puzzle. You have a problem that has an open ended solution, but also has limits. What you want to do is give a solution to that problem that hasn't been given before.
    avatar
    MynxTheOrigin

    Posts : 275
    Join date : 2013-02-12
    Age : 22
    Location : Maine

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by MynxTheOrigin on Tue Feb 26, 2013 9:52 pm

    Very well put, bro.

    Dessim8

    Posts : 4
    Join date : 2013-02-16

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by Dessim8 on Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:07 pm

    I know its' an old thread, but it's an interesting topic.

    Personally, I'd love to see champions that require unconventional itemization.

    For instance: an AP Mage whose nukes all do physical damage and strike armor: what do you build? Sorc Shoes are worthless to provide pen so I guess you can get Ionian Boots or something defensive, and all Armor Penetration items waste itemization on AD. I guess a Brutalizer would be okay for the Pen/CD combo, but Ghost blade and Black Cleaver aren't ideal (though I guess if you autoattack once or twice to proc its powers you can get some strong nukes.


    STILL, other items would be obvious: RoA, Zhonya's, Archangel's, Deathfire Grasp, Athene's and Deathcap should be easy choices, but the Crystal Scepter's Slow is worthless because your damage is NOT magical and Spell Pen and Vamp items are also useless though I guess Abyssal's MR could be 'okay' but if you want survival so badly, you'd have much more synergy with a RoA or two and if MR is so important, get a BVeil.

    Sheen may sound fun, but it wouldn't effect your spells because they're nukes and not extensions of your auto-attack, which would be naturally low like a mage's.


    Unless you have a passive which allows you to convert spell vamp and Mpen into their counterparts... but wouldn't that just be a passive that kinda nullifies the unique challenge of building this champ right? Maybe I'm crazy.


    Or what of the reverse? A nuke based mage whose magic damage spells are empowered by AD, whether total or bonus. Some may claim OP because you can auto-attack, but without a kit that supports auto-attack, would you really want to focus on auto-attacking?


    Also, it'd be great to see champion that can hybridize roles you might WTF at: Carry/Support hybrid anyone? Maybe they wouldn't be so good at simultaneous play, much like how Sion isn't good at simultaneously being a bruiser and a mage but can do both roles decently. When your opponents see you at the draft screen, they might need to have to second-guess your choice of character and wonder: is thuis guy going Jungle or support.

    Maybe a Jungle/support type character isn't the sort of jungler who comes into the fight with the intent on cleaning up, but a rescue type character more adept at clutch healing at critical moments. You may say: better to just kill? I don't know, I'm not the most meta-savvy person, but I'm always up for turning it upside down.

    Maybe I'm not making much sense here, but you want unique, I'd say you slap it right in the player's face and say "THIS IS DIFFERENT!"
    avatar
    Icraig33
    Admin

    Posts : 63
    Join date : 2013-02-10
    Age : 22
    Location : Canada

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by Icraig33 on Sat Apr 06, 2013 2:44 am

    Dessim8 wrote:
    STILL, other items would be obvious: RoA, Zhonya's, Archangel's, Deathfire Grasp, Athene's and Deathcap should be easy choices, but the Crystal Scepter's Slow is worthless because your damage is NOT magical and Spell Pen and Vamp items are also useless though I guess Abyssal's MR could be 'okay' but if you want survival so badly, you'd have much more synergy with a RoA or two and if MR is so important, get a BVeil.

    Well actually, last I checked spellvamp and Rylai's proc'd on ability damage, not merely magic damage. So unless all of your abilities were AA modifiers or proc'd AA on-hit effects instead, they would still work fine. I may be wrong on the rylai's bit but I know for a fact that spellvamp works regardless of damage type because Pantheon's Q and E proc it.

    EDIT: I just hopped on a quick custom match and I can confirm that pantheon not only procs spellvamp with Q/E, but he also procs Rylai's.
    avatar
    MynxTheOrigin

    Posts : 275
    Join date : 2013-02-12
    Age : 22
    Location : Maine

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by MynxTheOrigin on Tue Apr 09, 2013 12:20 am

    I see what you're getting at and I like some of the ideas.

    Sponsored content

    Re: What does it take for a concept to be unique?

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Mon Sep 25, 2017 1:36 pm